Ep. 64 | Boss Babes & Sourdough Sisters: The Coaching Extremes Holding Women Back
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
Hey legend. Welcome back to another episode. So last week we had episode 62 alpha Kings and linen bros. Why coaching for men is missing the mark. And I mentioned that that was the first episode of a series of two. I don't know if you'd call that a series, a two part series. That one was all for men. This one is for women.
Now that's not to say men that you shouldn't listen. You will absolutely get something out of this as well. And just like I said in the other episode, you will likely get something out of this. Just like the women got something out of the Alpha Kings and Linen Bros one. I bloody love that title. So today we are titling this one Boss Babes and Sourdough Sisters, the coaching extremes holding women back.
This is obviously to do with the extremes that I am seeing in the coaching industry. Just like with the men. With the coaching for men where there was two extremes of like your alpha hyper masculine men. And I don't, look, I think [00:01:00] masculinity is awesome. If you haven't listened to that episode, please go and listen to it.
I'm not shitting on masculinity. I'm shitting on the performative masculinity that's in the alpha bros. And then you've got the soft bros, you know, the ones that are more into their feminine, I would say as men. And that is what is the two extremes you see in the coaching industry. Whereas the awesome coaches.
The ones that are really helping men tend to lie in the middle, which is rare, as I said, in the other episode, normally I would not sit in the middle on any topic on anything, but in the middle of those two extremes seems to be the sweet spot for actually helping men. So same with women. So we've got two extremes and both are missing the mark for women as well.
So let's be real for a second. How many times have you actually scrolled past those boss babe coaches that are preaching 5am starts, which by the way, I'm an early morning person. So for context, I'm not shitting on 5 a. m. wake ups, okay? Stick with me. But these are the type of individuals, the type of women, the boss babe women, who are [00:02:00] preaching that real hustle culture of, you know, rise and grind, get up at the crack of dawn, and outwork everybody kind of mentality.
Then you've got on the other end of the spectrum, you've got the divine feminine sisters, which are all about frolicking in your linen dresses and baking sourdough and claiming that surrender and flow is all that you need to be successful. Now I'm going to sound like an utter wanker saying that because it sounds like I'm just shitting on every woman out there because you could say that all of us fit somewhere in there.
Well, no, not the case.and look, I may sound like a bit of a wanker saying that. I think baking sourdough bread is bloody awesome. And I actually wish someone would teach me. Okay. I'm just jealous that you know how to bake sourdough bread because that is fricking hard. I'm also not mocking you if you wear linen dresses. Okay.
This is like the stereotype that I'm talking about where on one extreme, you've got women who are just all about hustle, grind, burn yourself out. No matter what, you've got a dominate and conquer type of attitude. It's like a competition. Or on the other end of the extreme, you've got [00:03:00] the divine feminine sisters that are all about, you know, frolicking in dresses.
It's hysteria, stereotype of just, you know, surrender and flow is all that you need to be successful. And look, you know what I'm talking about. You've got those hyper masculine side. You've got the rise and grind quotes that go with the typical boss babe, you know, packing the schedule as tight as possible.
Like burnout is the biggest badge of honor that you can possibly wear. And then on the other side, you've got the women who swing very, very far into the. Spiritual softness, which is awesome by the way, there are awesome things to both of these sides, but they've convinced themselves on this far pendulum swing, where it's way into the soft, feminine, divine, feminine, goddess, Queens, frolicking in dresses and making sourdough bread, where now they will shit on ambition.
And they'll say the ambition is toxic. And any form of structure is just killing your feminine energy. Here's the truth, neither side fully works, they're both missing the mark [00:04:00] to a degree. And I want to be really effing clear here, just like in the men's coach episode, where I said, I'm not a masculine energy coach and that's not at all what I'm claiming to be or want to be.
I'm also not a feminine energy coach. I'm not here to teach you how to be more feminine. Well, to tell you that ambition makes you masculine. This is my point here. That's not my lane. I respect women who hold both fire and softness, and I will never tell you to water down either. This is why, again, when it comes to coaching women, I sit slap bang in the middle.
I see awesome qualities in both. I think that you can have qualities of both without shitting on either side, even though it sounds like I am. You can be super feminine and soft and flowy and be fiery and ambitious and driven. You can hold both. And it's so rare to hear that these days. And I know women are getting sick of being told that their ambition is toxic and that they shouldn't, you know, be driven [00:05:00] or that they're weak.
If they're soft and they're flowy and they're surrendered, you get to be all of it. What I am here to do with this episode is to. Just slice through the bullshit that I do see in the coaching industry for women, by the way, this is not all coaches. This is not all coaches, but the best coaches that I've come across, or that I've even hired myself, literally sit slap bang in the middle.
They hold all of it in one. My coach, Brianna May, I've mentioned her before, she literally embodies all of that in one, and not to the extremes, like in the most beautiful way. I believe I hold all of that in one. I think some of the best coaches out there can hold all of it, can, can not be too far swung to one side of like the hustle grind, by the way, I think hustle is not a bad thing.
Like it's always context, but when you're too far into it and you're too far into masculine as a woman, you're too far into your hyper independence. You will get sick, you will get burnt out and you will repel men. Like there's no two ways about it. You will repel [00:06:00] strong men. And you might attract really passive.
Weak men, but you will repel most strong men, but then when you're too far in the other side, and it's just all about receive, receive, receive, but there's no structure. Like you just get nowhere in life. There's got to be both. So I find that the two extremes don't really serve most, and they definitely don't serve the type of women that would listen to this podcast or the type of women that would be on my social media accounts.
It would not serve you. I know that because we have similar traits and we're quite similar. I want to show you where the middle ground, which is where I coach from. Is the most powerful. In my opinion, it's a space that can sharpen your drive without actually hardening you as a woman. It can amplify your softness without stripping your ambition or trying to tell you that you're wrong for being ambitious as a woman.
because look, there's so much noise out there and women don't need more noise. That's not what I'm trying to do this episode. You don't need more noise. You don't need more performative empowerment or more rules for all that breaking rules around here. We are unruled. [00:07:00] We're the unruled people that listen to this podcast.
What I believe women need when it comes to coaching or recalibration work like what I'm about to put out to the world. We actually need refinement. It's refinement. It's precision and it's power that's actually embodied. It's not performed just like with the men like when I went through with the men's coaching one.
It's not performative. It's embodied.So this episode is going to break down why these two polarizing extremes are actually leaving women feeling more frustrated, more diluted, and more disconnected than ever before.
I want to cut right through that and show you why the middle ground is this space that actually lets you hold it all without burning out or softening your edge. Because I do think that's important. We can be soft as women without softening our edge. Our edge is what makes us. Unique and makes us stand out.
So let's start with the performative coaching. So this is known as the boss babe coach problem. Let's dive into it. This is the hyper masculine grind culture. [00:08:00] these are the types that would preach about, you know, getting up at the crack of dawn, 18 hour work days, constant hustle.
And that's the only option. The only path to success. I'm not shitting on getting up early. I'm an early riser. That's not what this is about. But when you are preaching, if for instance, if a boss babe coach is out there preaching that this is the only way to success, that burning yourself to the ground is the only way to success.
I would say that that's a them problem. That's that's on them, right? It's not healthy. Yes, have structure. Yes, be driven. Yes, be a hard worker. I'm not talking about, and this is why I'm going to bring both of the extremes, right? And why I think the middle is perfect because I'm not at all shitting on having consistency and discipline and structure.
And, you know. Having a level of responsibility in life, I think those are very important, but these are the type that will give you the messaging of no days off or work now, rest later, pushing the narrative that rest equals weakness. [00:09:00] That's what's at the core. I find in the boss babe. And why most people are turning away from that boss, babe kind of label and movement is because it, so many were getting burnt out and quite sick.
Their bodies were breaking down and their relationships were breaking down. And this is where they would see rest was a weakness. They would see softness as a weakness. These are the types that would celebrate burnout as the biggest badge of honor, as though like, look how hard I am at working. Look at how successful I am because I'm burnt out.
I must work hard. And they were actually confusing, overexerting themselves with achievementAnd so that gave them recognition and almost like love. It would be a way of validating themselves. I have burnout. Therefore I am worthy because I am an overachiever. In this boss babe movement, as you will, there's an overemphasis on competition. So it's all about outperforming men or other women, not just men, but also other women.
It's about taking what's yours. And if you're not at the [00:10:00] top, you're losing. It's very, it's very masculine. I will say that. It's a very masculine, dominating kind of way to be as a woman. It's also about positioning success as something to be. for in masculine terms. So they're likely to use things like conquering and dominating and competing.
Like these are the terms that they would associate with themselves. These are the type that would see softness as a weakness, just as I said, they would see rest as a weakness. They also see softness as a weakness within themselves. This means that they would discourage vulnerability. They would discourage.
emotional intelligence without necessarily saying that so they might not shit on the actual term emotional intelligence, but without realizing it, they would be discouraging it from within themselves, discouraging vulnerability, painting those types of things as liabilities, and it would force them into their hyper independence and they're very masculine traits, they would be promoting a hardened, hyper independent image where You know, needing someone, needing help of someone, needing to ask for help of someone would [00:11:00] be seen as a setback.
That's a weakness, which then would affect their relationships. Why is this a problem? I mean, it's pretty freaking obvious at this point, but burnout was disguised as success. Women would end up exhausted, disconnected, sick. Sick in their bodies, like chronic fatigue, pains that were unexplained. I saw this a lot, like I was doing root cause therapy, uh, last year and I'm bringing it back in April in a coaching package.
That was very common. Women feeling pains in their bodies that couldn't be explained by doctors. Women feeling like their bodies were literally turning against themselves, were breaking down. This is so, so common, women feeling very disconnected, feeling like they just couldn't feel themselves anymore.
There was just no connection anymore with their bodies. And they were wondering why success wasn't fulfilling them. it didn't feel like how they thought they would feel once they'd hit the pinnacle of whatever it was that they were going after. They were [00:12:00] ending up in hyper independence that was hurting them, not actually helping them.
They had this, I don't need anyone mindset. By the way, I've been in this myself before, especially in my twenties. I, I definitely swung into my hyper independence more in my masculine. Uh, I would say in part by being a police officer, but also just after that as well for a bit, it, it was like a sign of weakness.
If someone went to help me, cause in my mind, I'm like, but I can do it myself. I can do it myself. I don't need anyone. I'm actually highly capable myself. The thing is, that will destroy relationships. I know this first hand. That will destroy relationships. Because if your man, the man that you're in a relationship with, has no place in that relationship, and doesn't feel respected, and doesn't feel needed, there is no relationship.
That will break down very, very quickly. For a woman who's very hyper masculine or very hyper independent, She will [00:13:00] push away a man very, very quickly because he literally has no place in her life anymore. Yes, women, we can be highly capable, but that does not mean that asking for help is a weakness. That does not mean that needing help is a weakness.
And even if we are capable of doing something, how incredible does it feel to receive? Like to have our partner do something for us, to even though we know we can do it, to have them actually do it for us is an act of service and is one of the greatest acts of love. That a man can actually do for us. It gives him a place in our lives.
It gives him respect, but we're also cherished and loved. And I think that the boss babe culture really had a lot to play in breaking down relationships and breaking down a woman's connection with her body, as well as breaking down her actual physical body in, in a physical way. This, I don't need anyone mindset.
It leaves women feeling very, very isolated. It leaves us feeling unable to receive any form of support. Any form of love or [00:14:00] partnerships without just seeing everything as a weakness. It's when we are that hyper independent, the, I don't need anyone. We are literally isolating ourselves from everybody.
Nobody has a place in our lives anymore. Another reason why I see all this as a problem is there was a lot of leadership without resonance. So leadership became very performative based. You see this online a lot, very loud. Very dominant in the boss babe community. Very forceful rather than grounded.
Confident, like actual embodied confidence rather than faux confidence and non magnetic. Like when a woman is really grounded and confident and magnetic, it is very very palpable. And I will tell you she will not be a hyper independent masculine woman. But she also doesn't have to be on the other end of the extreme, which we're going to get into in a second.
Here's the bottom line, though. Feminine strength isn't found in imitation of masculine leadership. We are not here to compete with men. We're not. We are built so [00:15:00] differently. I mean, our cycle alone makes us incredibly different to men. We are built differently. It's in the ability to move with ambition and drive, but without rejecting softness, warmth, and intuition.
And this is, this episode will come full circle once I give both ends of the extreme and, and where I believe the actual power is held in the middle. But yeah, you can be all of those things. Let's talk about now though, the divine feminine guru problem. I'm so sick of seeing this shit all over Instagram.
Oh my God. Look, it was needed. It was needed just like I went through in the men's coaching episode. So the feminist movement, I'm not a feminist, but the feminist movement, just to make that fricking clear, the feminist movement pushed women into this boss, babe, alpha woman archetype, where now we are seeing a lot of women struggling in relationships, struggling with our connection to our body, [00:16:00] struggling with libidos.
Struggling with isolation because we've pushed everybody out, all of those things, right? So, as a way to compensate and to correct that came the feminine flow, you know, the divine feminine gurus, which very much needed. Awesome. There's some incredible women out there who are teaching on femininity and the divine feminine and all of that.
It's needed, okay? So I'm not shitting on it. It is very much needed. But obviously there comes a pendulum swing where things can go a bit too far. So then what has happened is. With that movement, which was great as a way to correct where the feminist movement went too far and push women into their masculine and push women into complete burnout and competing with men and pretty much shitting on men and hating men and thinking we can just do better with everything.
God, I shudder at the thought of a world with no men. I'm not going to lie. And no, I'm not a fricking pick me, but it is true. If we had no men in the world, the world would crumble like in a week. [00:17:00] We'd be like. All of us women on our period would destroy this world in one week. But anyway, even though we're highly capable and we're awesome, just I know you know what I'm talking about.
But then the pendulum swung too far with this divine feminine guru thing, right? Because it then shat on everything in the boss babe, shat on everything. If you have any form of ambition, you're, you're basically called a man as a woman. You're basically called a man. If you have any drive, if you have any discipline, any consistency.
If you want to have a career, you are shat on as you must be a shit mother or you must not be traditional or you are too in your masculine and that message I have an issue with because it's not about the two extremes. It's about coming into the middle and honoring both in a healthy, integrated, embodied way.
So the divine feminine guru problem, all flow, no structure. This is where they preach. If it's meant for you, it will flow. Without, because that's an awesome message. [00:18:00] Okay. I do believe that, but without any discipline, any action or strategy, that's pretty much a load of bullshit. You still have to get off your ass and do something about it, right?
There's also business advice that's focused solely on energetics and alignment, which I freaking love energetics. I like bloody oath. Spinal energetics is one of the, the modalities that I'm launching soon. I love energy work, but if it's dismissing the need for practical steps and consistency, There's a problem, right?
There's a problem. Also, in this divine goddess feminine movement, there's a lot of shaming of ambition, as I said before. There's the messaging that frames ambition as a woman is stuck in wounded masculine energy, which is ridiculous. You can be a very feminine woman and be ambitious. If you haven't heard that before, I'm really sorry that you have not heard that before, but it is true.
You can be a very feminine woman and be [00:19:00] ambitious.this movement of the divine feminine goddess movement went too far as to say that any woman with a drive is shamed for being too structured or you're not surrendered enough. Also, everything is just over spiritualized. It went a bit too far.
I'm very spiritual minded. Okay. I love esoteric concepts. I love philosophical chats. I'm very open to energy work. I'm not religious black by believing God. And I love thinking about who is God. What is God? All of these things, right? I'm very open to a lot of things that would be deemed as But the problem is, it did swing a little bit too far.
It was selling the idea that women should only move when called, or only when inspired. But it was leading a lot of women to stagnation. They were getting so freaking bored. They were getting so bored in their lives because they're just waiting, waiting, waiting, waiting. At some point we still have to take action in life.
There was endless moon ceremonies, crystal healing, womb activations. I'm not shitting on them. Let me finish my [00:20:00] sentence before you all scream at me. If you love those things.but if there's nothing about integrating these practices with tangible movement in your life, they mean sweet F all like truly they mean sweet F all. Why is this a problem? Femininity is being sold as passive and I don't like it. Being feminine does not mean you're passive. There's this idea of like, you've just got to sit around, just sit back, just wait.
Just wait, just be a waiting princess keeps women stuck in cycles of just inaction and absolute boredom. I believe very strongly that ambition and softness can coexist. Let me say that again. I believe very, very strongly that ambition and softness in a woman can coexist. Your drive doesn't actually cancel out softness.
I believe it sharpens it and I want you to think of it like this because I this it you don't hear this. You really don't hear this. If you give your drive some [00:21:00] direction, that is the fire that propels you forward. So if your drive has no direction in life, you're, you're driven, but you're told you just wait and receive, wait and receive, wait and receive 24 seven.
Nothing is propelling you forward. Your softness can add resonance. This is big. It's the presence that allows that ambition to land with power, not aggression. This is where if you're that driven, but you're also hyper masculine and hardened as a woman, you will lead to burnout. If you just don't allow yourself to rest or stop because you're, you get all recognition from how burnt out you are all recognition from,everything that you can show like your KPIs or your performance reviews or whatever it might be, right?
You will become burnt out. You can add softness to your drive and it lands with power and not with aggression and not with burnout. Softness without any form of ambition can feel very passive to a woman. I believe you can have both. Ambition [00:22:00] without softness can feel quite cold in a woman.
But when combined together, that softness becomes intentional. It's actually backed by purpose. It makes your ambition feel grounded, feel irresistible as a woman. You don't just push forward. You pull opportunities towards you when you actually have the softness and the ambition. It becomes effortless because your energy is balanced.
It's not forced, but it's not passive. It's a beautiful combination. That was just a side tangent for you. Another reason why I see a problem with going too far into this divine feminine goddess, frolicking movement structure actually supports freedom. so if you've got flow, but with absolutely no structure, that will lead to chaos that will lead to indecision that will lead to a lack of progress.
This is why I believe you need both. It's not about rejecting flow, right? So don't reject the flow that is encouraged in the divine feminine goddess movement. But integrate it with the structure. It's not about rejecting softness. It's about [00:23:00] pairing it with your ambition. Now just like in the men's coaching episode that I did, I want to talk about the damage of non dualistic thinking.
It's the either or problem. So this is the message that you're being told and taught as a woman is that you're either soft or you're strong. Think about that for a second. This is what we are taught. You're either strong because you're a feminist or you're a boss babe. That's the messaging you get with that.
Or you're labelled as soft if you're in the Divine Feminine Goddess movement, right? Two extremes, strong, soft. Why can't we be both? This is my message. We can, we absolutely can. Another one is you're either told that you're feminine or you're ambitious. Either or. You can't be both apparently, you have to pick one.
You're either ambitious or you're feminine. And if you're feminine, You may be shat on by the boss babe or the feminist community. If you [00:24:00] are ambitious, you may be shat on by the, the feminine flowy community. You're constantly taught you have to pick one. You can't be both, which is bullshit. You're also taught that you're either intuitive or you're driven.
Again, it's bullshit. Life isn't dualistic. You get to hold both. Feminine energy isn't just softness. Right. Cause that is what you basically hearing online. It's just softness. That's all it is. Just soft, soft, soft, soft, soft, soft, which is beautiful quality in women. It's a beautiful quality in femininity, but feminine energy.
Isn't just that it's also fire. There's also depth to it. There's precision to it. My God, you think of some of the most powerful women in the world that are also feminine and use them as an example of you get to be both. You don't have to pick one or the other. You get to hold both within you and not be shamed for holding them.
I think it's the healthiest place to be. This is why I coach from the middle [00:25:00] ground.
I mentioned in the men's episode that I'll be launching a service in April, which is like coaching package that also combines spinal energetics. And I just want to speak to the women that I will be working with. I will not shame your drive. I just want you to know that I will never shame your drive. I will never shame your ambition.
I won't tell you that your ambition makes you masculine, but I also won't just sit and watch you if you're in hyper independence and say nothing. Cause that would also be unhealthy and that would make me a shit coach. I'll show you how to move with both softness and fire without hardening or performing.
My approach isn't just mindset work. It's not just healing by the way. I don't like that term. If you're new to my podcast, I don't see myself as a healer. I believe we heal ourselves, but I do full system recalibration work and it's about unwinding everything within our bodies that maybe is slowing us down or maybe that is not making sense.
Maybe you're the [00:26:00] type of woman who does everything right. You're the type, right, for lack of a better word. You're the type that looks after your health, that looks after your body. You're the type that does, you know, the mindset work and maybe you're very spiritual or you question a lot about life and maybe you even are into optimising your health or whatever it might be, right?
Maybe you've had energy work done or some type of, you know, system work. You do all the right things, but there's things that are still in your system that aren't making sense, even though you are on top of your game. These would be things like maybe unexplained pains. It could be really severe anxiety, or even just low levels of anxiety.
Just feeling like you cannot sit still. You cannot breathe. As soon as it gets quiet, it's unnerving. You may be Awesome in chaos, you can probably handle chaos like an absolute pro, but when it comes to silence, that feels scarier than fricking hell. And maybe you have an inability to rest or to [00:27:00] receive, or maybe you struggle with holding money.
Maybe you're great at investing. Maybe you're great at spending money, but you really struggle to receive all these things would tell me a lot about your body. It needs a full recalibration, right?our nervous system needs a recalibration. So this is the work that I do. it's not about healing.
It's not about fixing you. You are already whole, but it's about getting to the root cause of things and actually unwinding it from a physical and a nervous and an energetic layer and realm. So I just want you to ask yourself these questions. Are you hardening yourself as a woman to be taken seriously? Are you avoiding ambition because of fear of being called too much or are you avoiding ambition because you're scared? Someone's gonna tell you you're too masculine as a woman that used to be me.
Are you rejecting polarity? So like in relationships because you think trust means weakness that is huge for a lot of [00:28:00] women They can hold a room like no other. They can speak publicly, they can make big, bold decisions in their careers, in their businesses, whatever it might be. But the moment they are about to be held by their man, it's freaking shit, scary to be vulnerable to that level, or maybe it's.
Receiving help from somebody. It scares them to their core. This is huge for women who are used to being hyper independent. So this episode is all about the call for balanced power. This conversation matters because the coaching industry is flooded with the extremes. It's got women that are rejecting their natural instincts.
So they're femininity or they're shamed for ambition. Most leaders that are in the coaching industry. Most are pushing narratives that leave a lot of women very confused, very disconnected and very burnt out. And I'm talking about the ones that are on the polar end of those extremes. Right in the middle though, there are incredible coaches and this is why I wanted to build something different,
This is why in [00:29:00] April I'm launching something that will cut through the noise and that will be so different to a lot of what you see out there In the coaching industry in the self healing or healing spaces. No, it's not another fluffy program Fluffy empowerment program that does jack shit for you. No, it's not another soft feminine Queen echo chamber God make me vomit right now This is for women who have done the work, but you know that there's another level to hit.
It's a full system recalibration that will strip out or unwind every ounce of friction that is holding you back, or that is making you question what the crap is going on. Why don't I feel how I believe I should be feeling? This will help you move sharper, cleaner, stronger. So if this episode has hit you hard, get ready, because what I'm dropping in April is for the ones who are done settling for three quarter capacity.
These are the ones who are built different. These are for women who are self-led, and they're sick of the [00:30:00] messaging, telling them that there's something wrong with them. There's nothing wrong with you my love. I really want you to know that this comes from personal experience. This is why I created this episode.
I was at war with myself for so long. I was like, I'm both, I don't want to pick Elaine. I'm both. I'm ambitious, driven, disciplined, consistent, I'm all those things and I'm sick of being told by the online messaging that that means that I'm too masculine or I'm a man. I'm soft, I'm flowy, I'm feminine, I'm warmth, I'm all of those things, I receive, I, like, all of that.
But I'm sick of that being shat on as that means I'm weak or I'm passive or I'm just this little pick me who's just waiting like a damsel in distress. It's bullshit, we get to hold all of that in one. So. This is for the women who are sick of the messaging that is telling them that there's something wrong with them or that you're broken or you're defunct or you need fixing.
The messaging out there is absolute bullshit for most women. So when my service launches in April, you [00:31:00] won't even have to ask if it's for you. You'll just know, you'll bloody know it in the core of your body. And no, this isn't all about that, but I do just want to mention it for this episode.
we'll leave it at that. I just wanted to say thank you so much for tuning in. You're an absolute legend. I appreciate you being here for the second part of the two part series. And listen, let me know your thoughts. Have you noticed the two polar extremes in the coaching industry? What are your thoughts on it?
Do you tend to swing either of those sides? Which side are you drawn more to? Or are you like me, where you're like, F it all, I'm right in the middle and I refuse to be put into a box. I refuse to wear a label that society thinks I need to wear. I'm gonna be all of it and none of it at the same time.
Anyway, I love your guts. Thanks for being here, Ledgen, and we'll chat soon. Bye!
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